Clipboard Jesus Visits The Browns
One of the few pleasures this season regarding the Browns, at least for me, has been the joy of getting to add two heads to my Browns QB hydra, RG3 and Cody Kessler. For those who don’t know what I mean, I keep a photoshop file on handy of every Browns QB who has started a game since 1999. Not every QB who has played, just every named starter, which is honestly bad enough. It’s my own version of the Browns jersey in Cleveland which was retired this past season thanks to Basketball making the owner feel optimistic. That has proven rather hilarious. I was excited when the Browns picked up Clipboard Jesus (Charlie Whitehurst) because with him and Terrelle Pryor getting time at QB I thought I was going to have a record year for hydra additions. Sadly it was not to be, Clipboard Jesus lasted two weeks.
He’s gone because he got hurt. He got hurt after being put in the game for Cody Kessler, who got hurt. Cody looks to be okay now, so Clippy Jeez wasn’t worth keeping if he was injured. The Browns QB carousel this season has really been something else, hasn’t it? They start with RG3, already a highly questionable move, but one that might bear fruit, and he immediately dies. They stick in Josh McCown, which at two years now feels like a seasoned Browns QB veteran. He immediately dies. We get Cody Kessler, some dude from USC, and he lasts a game, and then kinda dies. Charlie Whitehurst, who wasn’t close to sniffing a roster to begin the season, was suddenly the backup, and then suddenly actually playing. On top of that, the Browns have occasionally thrown Pryor in there to do things, but they probably want him to stay at WR since he’s doing well there. I hope they let him start a game. In the meantime, I might need to get a picture on file of Kevin Hogan, practice squad QB, elevated to the roster thanks to Chipboard Jesus’ departure. Something tells me him or Pryor is going on that Hydra before this year is out.
I also wonder just how much Hue Jackson regrets his choice of team yet. They all start with the promises, and they all end up in the toilet really fast. The Browns front office is like a faulting nuclear reactor, with coaches occasionally sacrificing themselves to run in and expose themselves to a fatal dose in an attempt to stop the leak. At this point the reactor core is just full of bodies.
Anyway here is the current hydra picture
Can you name them all?
How the hell has that hydra not collapsed under the weight of its own heads by now?
It’s a robot powered by sadness.
Lets see…rg3, kessler, mccown, manziel, weeden, hoyer, Thad lewis, Seneca wallace, mccoy, couch, dilfer, wynn, quinn, anderson, garcia, campbell, shaw, davis, Holcomb, and pederson. Which six am I forgetting?
I know Delhomme is one. Not so sure about the others.
Ty Detmer, Chuck frye, Ken dorsey, Bruce gradkowski, and the other Mccown, luke.
Add Charlie Frye and Bruce Gradkowski. And you can count McCown another time – they’ve started both Luke and Josh. Can’t think of the others at the moment.
To the last panel: “Don’t fear the reaper”
THE HUMPING SQUIRRELS ARE BACK! XD
At some point there has to be an upper limit on how many how many heads that body can sustain. I mean there’s no way a body like that can provide so much blood to so many brains, right? :p
This image is so depressing. Tim Couch played his last game 13 years ago. Wow.
I don’t know if the blood even goes to Manziel’s head.
Man the QB hydra was monstrous before but it is truly an abomination now… O.o
I like Kessler, he’s got a good chemistry with TP. Hopefully the Browns give Hue AT LEAST the 3 year grace period, he’s making this this team at least competitive in every game (except Brady’s fuck Goodell game).
They should’ve beaten Miami, Washington, and Baltimore.
Exactly, and doesn’t it seem like a browns move to fire him if he only wins like 2 games this year?
Rod Chudizinski (2013 coach) disagrees with you
I’ve always had a soft spot for the browns, frankly it has passed being funny what that franchise goes through it is now just absurd how one franchise have that much bad luck. I was really hoping Clipboard Jesus could raise them from the dead but alas it was not meant to be. When Kessler inevitably breaks completly and they have to turn to Hogans heroes the Hydra will hopefully be complete for the season.
Holy shit, Hogan’s Heroes is my shit.
Sooooo… No clipboard Jesus.
Clipboard Jesus vs. Billy Volkswagen vs. Clipboard Sorgi vs. Steve Debleergh vs. McClowing the Vikings out of the playoffs for backup supremacy
Pat Delvin (3rd string in Miami last year) is also on Cleveland’s practice squad.
Calling it right now; Sexy Rexy returns to Cleveland
Much like Hercules, the GOAT slayed the Hydra
I see those tags. If “Tom Brady isn’t the GOAT” becomes the new running gag/Easter Egg, I welcome it with open arms.
It’s the new Sexy Rexy.
Honestly, I don’t know what else Brady can do to convince Dave that he’s the GOAT. Also, is anyone familiar with Uffsides or FitzyGFY?
If Brady wants to convince me he’s the GOAT, he needs to go to another team that isn’t nearly as well run as the Patriots, and then play just as well if not better and win a Super Bowl. My entire argument for Brady not being the GOAT is that as good as he is, he’s been put in possibly the best position to succeed of all time under the GOAT coach and a fantastic front office/owner. I firmly believe that if he was stuck on teams with lesser coaches, lesser talent, lesser ownership like Peyton, Rodgers, Brees, Marino, etc, he’d not have the career he has had. He might not even be in the league still.
Brady has had the GOAT career for a QB, but he’s not the GOAT when he’s achieved most of that with the help of a support system the rest of the league dreams of. Football is a team sport through and through, what’s around him matters a lot, and Brady has had the best around him.
To be the GOAT, you have to have a good team behind you. I mean, Montana would have just been Marino (or an Eli Manning) without Dwight Clark, Jerry Rice and without Bill Walsh building a powerhouse team.
Your never going to have a true apples to apples comparison, as Montana was in a different era than Brady, or any of the classic great QBs.
Tom Brady definitely did not have lesser talent around him than Peyton. Manning had Harrison and Wayne for a decade, he had Marshall Faulk his rookie year, and had James as his HB during the early 2000s. Then he signed with a stacked Broncos team. In 2013, Mannings fourth best target was Tom Brady’s number one the year before. Tom Brady won his first three Super Bowls throwing the ball to guys like Troy Brown and Deion Branch. Also, Rodgers had a great WR corps the year he won his Super Bowl.
The argument for having superior coaching does hold some water, but outside of 2008, when he went 11-5 (with a team nearly identical to the 16-0 juggernaut from the year before, sans Brady) Belichick was never really great without Tom. He made the playoffs one year with the Browns, but had an overall losing record with that team (though to be fair, I think the announcement of the move to Baltimore did affect the team somewhat).
A lot of the time, when people talk about system quarterbacks, it means that a particular roster or offensive system allowed the player to succeed. But Brady is the only guy left from that 2001 Super Bowl, and the system has changed many times over the years. There was the run-first, ball control offense of the early 2000s, there was the deep passing vertical offense with Moss, there was the two TE heavy sets of 2011-2012, and in 2014, there was the quick, West Coast-esque offense that won Super Bowl 49. The quality of the defense, WR corp, and offensive line has varied throughout the years, but the team is always competitive, and the only constant is Tom Brady. If you ask me, Tom Brady IS the system; he is a smart, versatile QB who can run a multitude of offenses depending on what kind of personnel make up the rest of the team.
Dave, I think you are a smart guy. You know a lot about football and your comic is one of my favorite on the internet. If you think Manning or Rodgers is better, that is fine. I disagree, but I can see why you would think that way. But I think saying Brady is a system QB is just crazy.
*Tom Brady definitely had lesser talent around him than Peyton
stupid typo
You still kind of missed my point because you’re still ignoring the situation Brady was in and cherry picking the part that Peyton had better. Brady absolutely had worse offensive talent around him (At WR mostly) in his early seasons, but he had a much better defense on the other side of the ball then Peyton ever did, and a much better coach then Peyton ever did. Brady wasn’t actually elite his first few seasons, the defense was. The defense won two super bowls and Corey Dillon was a big reason the other happened. Brady didn’t turn into elite BRADY until later, when he got weapons. because Football is a team sport.
Brady isn’t necessarily a system QB (That was a trolling joke because Pats fans are easy and fun to rattle) but outside WRs in his early career, he had it better around him than Peyton did in every way. Brady never had to do as much as Peyton to win games because he had a defense and a GOAT coach backing him up instead of just better WRs.
The greatest QB of all time can only do so much for a team sport like football. He can’t catch the passes. He can’t block. he can’t be the runningback. He can’t play defense. Despite being so important to a team, QBs are still heavily influenced by what’s around them to win games. In that sense, Brady is privileged, which makes it really hard to see how good he’d be otherwise. That’s really what I mean when I suggest the system is Brady. This is why I don’t value wins and championships as something you can use to evaluate how good an individual is.
Marino is still the #2 because he was putting up numbers we would consider elite today 20 years before passing was as inflated as it is now, and frankly him and Peyton flip flop for who I think is better while Brady sits comfortably at #3.
On the offensive side of the ball, Manning definitely had the better teams. I think the defensive side of the ball is another story though, especially when the dynasty was happening. Those early 2000s Pats teams were loaded on defense. McGinest, Bruschi, Seymour, Law, Harrison. They won Super Bowl XXXVI with 13 offensive points, which is pretty insane when you think about it. In 2001 they allowed 17 points a game, in 2003 they allowed under 15 points a game (1st in the league), and in 2004 they still allowed under 17. That’s championship-caliber defense and had a lot to do with the three Super Bowls.
Brady was clutch and did exactly what he needed to do. His team helped set the stage for him to succeed and he capitalized on his opportunities. The question is, how would other great quarterbacks have fared in that same situation? Those dynasty years were obviously much more favorable conditions than what the average quarterback ever gets to go through. I think the fact that Brady won 3 Super Bowls in his first 4 years and just 1 in the proceeding 11 even though he has gotten so much better since is a reminder of just how much of a team accomplishment it is. If you won more Super Bowls at a time when you were not as good, that must mean the team surrounding you was pretty damn good back then.
I personally think Brady is the GOAT, I just also think people need to remember the context of the incredibly fortunate circumstances he’s in in New England. They are the best circumstances in the NFL (and possibly NFL history) and it’s not even close. That needs to be brought up in the arguments.
I wasn’t trying to discount the contributions of the defense, I know that we had some great players for those first 3 Super Bowls. If not for Ty Law’s pick six in 2001, I don’t think we beat the Rams in Super Bowl 36. And I wasn’t trying to say rings were all that mattered. If they were, Robert Horry would be the greatest NBA player of the modern era. I just get annoyed when people (not you guys) act like Tom Brady pulled a Trent Dilfer and rode the coattails of some unholy offspring of the 90s Cowboys and 70s Steelers to 4 undeserved rings.
Dave, I love ya, but that’s just silly.
Brady was elite his first few seasons– especially in the post season. He went up against great defenses, and he had better post-season numbers than Manning had regular-season numbers. Sure, his regular season numbers didn’t mimic Manning’s, but Elway’s never mimicked Marinos, but if you’re going to claim Elway wasn’t an elite QB, I think there’s a lot to QB play that you need to re-evaluate. A great QB does what their team needs, and if that isn’t stat friendly, that’s not on the QB– that’s on the team plan, it’s on the supporting cast. Just like you don’t get to give Brady 100% of the credit for Patriot Super Bowls, you really cannot look at numbers outside of context in a team game.
Also: Marino arguably isn’t even a top 10 all time QB, and there’s no rational perspective that can call him a top 2. Top 2 arm talent all time? Sure, I’ll buy that. But QB play is so, so much more than how fast you can throw, or even how accurately you can throw. It’s decision making (Marino and Manning were both very questionable on that regard against great defenses), it’s the ability to take a hit and keep playing (Look up Manning and Marino’s numbers following 2 sacks in a game, then look up Brady and Elway– the drop off from the Ms is enormous, while Brady + Elway show virtually no fall off from their performance earlier in the game), their ability to manage the clock (Manning was excellent at this, arguably the best the game’s ever known; Marino was mediocre at best with this in terms of elite QB comparison, his SoL play notwithstanding).
While the limitations of any one player are obviously true, let’s also not fall into the trap of elevating the importance of stats. You can’t quantify the most important aspects of quarterback greatness, or at least not easily. While rings are over-rated by many (Rating Bradshaw above Elway or equal to Brady is a very difficult task to defend), they still matter– not the first, but once you start looking at repeats? It matters. One quarterback *CANNOT* win the Super Bowl, but if they aren’t benched, they can *ABSOLUTELY* lose games.
Marino lost key games all on his own. Manning did, too. And when you look at Manning’s rings, his play never elevated his team to winning greatness; they won in spite his mediocrity-to-badness in the post season. Marino never elevated his play to be someone his team could count on. There are reasons beyond his betrayal of the Green Bay fan base that Favre isn’t cited as a #1, in spite of his stats– he cost his team so many games with his poor decision making, that you just can’t put him at the top of the list, not when you have Starrs, Grahams, Montanas, Bradys, and Elways who were positive difference makers in their teams success, particularly and especially in the post season.
Say what you want Dave, but in every Super Bowl Brady’s played, which btw is 6, the most all time, he has given his team the lead with under 3 minutes to play. He is literally 2 Eli miracles from being as clutch as Michael Freakin Jordan. If that isn’t GOAT, I don’t know what is.
To everyone who disagrees, I’m fine with that, I think there are arguments for Brady they just aren’t ones I value as highly.
For me it will always come down to the fact that Brady has been given an outstandingly stable situation (That he has certainly made outstanding in part with his own play) that almost every other player in existence hasn’t been afforded. Having the same HoF coach for 16 years is a luxury I don’t think any player in the modern age has ever or will ever have. I just feel Peyton has done more with less and Marino doesn’t get enough credit because he didn’t win a ring. When I look at Brady, I think mostly about how great the entire Patriots team is. When I look at Peyton, I think about how great He was.
I don’t really think anyone’s mind is going to change at this point so I’m just going to go back to trolling Pats fans since I’ve stated my serious opinion enough by now
Idunno, Dave. Manning may have had different head coaches, but they were always– ALWAYS– conformed to Manning’s system. I look at the teams Manning had, and I do mostly think about how good his pieces were (especially his offensive lines– he had a line for one year like Brady’s had most of his, and that was in 2015). How system-friendly Manning’s situation has always been. I’m not going to downplay the fact that Brady has had Belichick his entire career, but Belichick never won anything without Brady, and I think dismissing that out of hand is silly.
Also, the reason Marino gets downgraded for not having any rings, is because Marino’s playoff performances were never exceptional, and because there really aren’t a lot of excuses that other great QBs didn’t do more with. Marino had better coaching than Elway, he had (for most of his career) far better teams than Elway had, and when he had equal talent to Elway, he didn’t get as far, as often, as Elway did. He can have all the records, and Marino is an all-time great. But he never had the leadership, the post-hit-poise, or the grit to take things to a level beyond where his arm and natural talent alone were enough to propel his team past their level of skill and competence.
Great QBs do that.
Sure, Brady had some great players around him– look at how well they all did *away* from the Patriots. Some of that’s Belichick, no doubt, no question. But a *LOT* of it’s on Brady, too, and you can see that in the way he responds. When Brady gets hit, he gets *better* (most of the time– there are exceptions to every rule like that). When Manning’s getting sacked, though, he would get worse. Elway and Marino were the same way. Players talked about this a LOT with the Broncos, particularly in 1997– that Elway would take a hit, and get back up in spite being hurt, and play better. Play for revenge. And the team galvanized around that. It’s leadership, and it’s a determination to win. As brilliant as Marino’s throwing could be, he never exercised that kind of Will.
Starr did. Graham did. And of all the cases to give Johnny U top billing, it’s that grit and grind that he put out that gives him the best case. So, yes. Rings are over-rated, but they don’t not-matter, especially if you rarely/never even *get* to the dance. Marino had opportunities after 1984, and he never once seized them. He got rattled, and he got beat in head games. Same with Manning.
If your argument is that Manning and Marino are the most talented *passers* in NFL history, and that when everything was going for them, they were better than anyone else ever when everything was going for them, then I’ll agree without hesitation (excepting only the allowance that Rodgers might be better than both in that regard). But so much of what greatness is– in ANY field– isn’t how good you are when things are at their best, but when things are at their worst.
I will maintain that one of Brady’s single best performances (and one of the best, most heroic performances of any player I’ve ever seen in any game) was in the 2015 AFC Championship when he was getting destroyed by Denver. Brady fought every second of that game, he was abused more than any QB’s ever been abused, and he still almost pulled it off. He was battered, but he was mostly throwing extremely smart throws, even when they were incomplete, even if some were INTs. Statistically, that performance was horrible– it wasn’t all (or even mostly) on him, but he stood in there the whole time, and *took* it, and refused to bend to it, let alone break.
Marino doesn’t do that. Manning doesn’t do that. You may not value that highly, and I guess more power to you, but that game right there said more about Brady as a competitor than any number of passing or TD records ever will about Manning.
The sad part is… I’m not a Pats fan. I mean, I respect the way that they’ve built their organization, and I respect Belichick as a brilliant coach (and Ernie Adams as the greatest football mind ever). I have nothing against the Dolphins– as a kid, they were my #2 team behind Denver, since my favorite Aunt was a huge Dolphins fan. I always cheered on Marino (except when he was against Denver). He was a phenomenal talent.
But I will dispute vehemently that he was a phenomenal competitor, because his performance in tough times just doesn’t match up. And I don’t mean in close games… I mean when things were tough for him, *personally*. He didn’t rebound well from personal set-back in games. Neither did Manning– pure memory and perception right now, and it might make an interesting investigation to get the actual numbers on this, but I can’t think of any multi-ring winning QB, other than Eli, who has done worse in that regard than Manning. MANY who have been worse than Manning *before* getting hit, but none who have had that stark a drop-off. You hit Brady, you better kill him or keep knocking him down because he’s coming back swinging.
I think the G.O.A.T. debate is pointless to have unless it is for entertainment’s sake; it’s all subjective. We will never really know the the greatest is or was. However, I think we can all agree that the names typically thrown around are great. Why should their placement among their peers matter?
That being said, I find it odd that TB gets a knock for playing on one team. Someone in another comic asked if Brady could take the Browns to a SB and win. Could Manning? Sure, he made it to two SBs and won one with another team, but it’s not like he left to play for the Browns. He went to a pretty good team. I don’t think Brady could take the Browns to a SB with the time he has left, but if he was traded to a decent team, he might.
Who cares? It’s all speculation anyway. Dave’s list is no more valid than our own. In conclusion… Brady blows!
JK. TFB is the man!
let’s be honest, Hogan, Pryor, and Whitehurst are all gonna end up on that thing by season’s end. they will resign Whitehurst to start one game after all the other QBs die, and then he will die, and the NFL will have to force the Patriots to lend-lease Julian Edelman to Cleveland for Week 17 to play quarterback…at which point the Browns will win their only game and cost themselves the number one overall pick.
I was kinda expecting Joe Buck to jump out of the closet tbh
Not Halloween yet
The browns are gonna start our lord and savior Tim Tebow before the end of the season, and lo, he shall lead them to the promised land.
tim tebow can help the ill, but can he save the browns???
Tim Tebow can walk on water, but even he cannot save the Browns.
Ugh, I’d rather they go winless.
Why is Marino so high on your list Dave? Marino had the help of an all-time coach in Shula. How is Marino>Brady?
In unrelated news, can we all at least agree that Denver’s uniforms tonight are eye-bleedingly awful?
bronco’s uniforms: bad.
bronco’s play: also bad.
I just want to point out how much I love all the people using “WE” when talking about the Patriots. Dave, for how much you love to troll them, there sure are a lot of former (and maybe even current!) Patriot players and staffers that frequent this site and the comments section…
Poor Jake Delhomme.
HE didn’t deserve this after the Panthers cut him.
Browns put Bitonio on injured reserve. They now have one good lineman and one other starting caliber lineman. Erving has no business at center. He should be the right tackle, but they don’t have anyone else to play center, which means Pasztor is still the right tackle. Austin Pasztor let through the pass rusher that caused every injury to a Browns quarterback this season. And now, without Bitonio, they won’t have a rushing game anymore either. They’re gonna lose to the Titans 3-0 or something.
Bitonio is now their twelfth player on IR. They’ve had another five miss at least two full games due to injury, in five games. I’d say there has to be a hidden coaching issue, except that other than Haden’s groin and Campbell’s hamstring, they’re all chance injuries or freakish luck, like Corey Coleman getting his hand sandwiched in between two helmets.
Who’s the angry looking one with the flopover in the bottom right? Pederson?
I feel so bad for Browns fans. It’s bad when a Jags fan pities you.